The Smoking Gun

[Zerstörer]

http://www.cnn.com/2007/TECH/science/01/23/climate.report.ap/index.html?eref=rss_topstories

Check out this article. Now is it just me, or have any of these enviro-lefties ever thought for one second that perhaps the sun has something to do with global warming? Personally, I think it's pretty arrogant to think that human beings can change the atmosphere of our entire planet. Also, can someone explain to me why it seems that America is the only one ever criticized about global warming? Ever notice that not only is it mankind's fault that the Earth is warming, but more specifically it's America's fault? Why don't the whiny enviro-libs complain about China and other third world shitholes who pollute far worse than we could ever dream of? Maybe I'm out of my mind because many of my friends seem to think I am because they just accept whatever they're told by the media and Al Gore. Is there anyone out there who can back me up?

[LovetoSki]

Where does it say in the article that it is only Americas fault? I dont see that anywhere, nor do most repected scientists and politicians only blame America....stop being such a narcisist and realize its a global issue. The fact is that we still do pollute more than any other country - thats an undisputable fact. The vast majority of scientists belive that we have contributed to rising CO2 levels which in turn aid in the earth getting warmer.

Arrogant that we cant change the atmosphere of the planet? We could destroy the planet if we choose too - we have completely changed the face of the world and could easily change the entire atmoshpere. If we released all of our nuclear weapons at once you dont think the atmoshpere would change? I know its an extreme example but we most certainly can change the planet in very negative ways.

[Zerstörer]

Well, LovetoSki, apparently my beliefs are too radical. I'm glad you set me straight.

[LovetoSki]

Well, LovetoSki, apparently my beliefs are too radical. I'm glad you set me straight.


Your welcome - anytime!

[Zerstörer]

So I'm guessing you believe that global warming is anthropogenic?

[LovetoSki]

So I'm guessing you believe that global warming is anthropogenic?


A lot of evidence does point to human activity drastically increasing CO2 levels. I just dont understand why so many people are so quick to dismiss it as liberal propaganda. Im no expert and I dont study this stuff for a living....but to just denouce it becasue you think its arrogant that we can effect the atsmoshpere is foolish in my opinion.

A lot of republicans and conservatives are starting to turn the page and actually look at the evidence. Wait till Bush's state of the union tonight - it will be a main talking point.

[Zerstörer]

Do you not think the whole GW thing is overplayed? Do you seriously believe people when they say "in 20 years, Boston will be under water?"

[LovetoSki]

Do you not think the whole GW thing is overplayed? Do you seriously believe people when they say "in 20 years, Boston will be under water?"


I think people do exagerate in every aspect of life when they have an agenda. That doesnt mean that basis behind that agenda is completely false. I think some GW advocates do use scare tactics and try to incite fear in people so they will listen to their cause. I think that goes across all lines of society - its human nature.

But I said this in another post.....swicthing to alternate energy sources will only help the economy, not destroy it as others say. We no longer would be sending billions and billions of dollars to the ME and funding those who are our enemies. Complete new industries and job will be created as well, and those investment dollars will be going towards American companies, not ME Sheiks....

Its a win-win situation....

[Zerstörer]

My basic point is this: we haven't observed global warming long enough to determine conclusively whether it's human-caused. Also, as I mentioned earlier, it blows my mind that no one seems to think of what should be the obvious in the matter; the sun. None of the "expert climatologists" (at least the ones who say GW is entirely anthropogenic) even mention the sun as a possible contributor to global warming. It's ridiculous that none of those scientists who advocate GW consider that the very thing that provides us with heat could be responsible for the warming of our planet. Furthermore, many of the same people who now say global warming is such as catostrophic threat are the same ones who warned of global cooling only a few short decades ago. Which is it? It can't be both. Obviously, you're not going to agree with me on anything I say, but I think it's important to consider other causes of GW. Finally, I have no credentials at all on the matter, but I hardly think it takes a scientist to use common sense when it comes to the GW issue. If it even exists to the extent we're told, I believe it is a naturally occurring, cyclical phenomenon. Again, that is only my opinion since I have no authority whatsoever on the topic.

[dixiegirl]

Zer i couldn't agree with you more. everything is america's fault, or thats what were supposed to think. if only one species was capable of changing the atmosphere. we're mere men. nature will have her way over us anyday. we aren't responsible for global warming, if it even exists

[dixiegirl]

stupid lefties, why don't they worry about something they can change, or least help out, like teenage pregnancies or the drop out rate, drinking in youth, but no they attack something we can't even change just to get pissed at us mighty righties

[LovetoSki]

stupid lefties, why don't they worry about something they can change, or least help out, like teenage pregnancies or the drop out rate, drinking in youth, but no they attack something we can't even change just to get pissed at us mighty righties


Your right - every GW scientist is full of sh* - doesnt belive what they are preaching and are doing it just to try to take down the right in this country. Show me one reputable artile that blames all of global warming on America? Stop thinking the world revolves us...it doesnt! Your creating a straw man argument by saying that just so you can knock it down.........

What color is the sky in your world?

[LovetoSki]

My basic point is this: we haven't observed global warming long enough to determine conclusively whether it's human-caused. Also, as I mentioned earlier, it blows my mind that no one seems to think of what should be the obvious in the matter; the sun. None of the "expert climatologists" (at least the ones who say GW is entirely anthropogenic) even mention the sun as a possible contributor to global warming. It's ridiculous that none of those scientists who advocate GW consider that the very thing that provides us with heat could be responsible for the warming of our planet. Furthermore, many of the same people who now say global warming is such as catostrophic threat are the same ones who warned of global cooling only a few short decades ago. Which is it? It can't be both. Obviously, you're not going to agree with me on anything I say, but I think it's important to consider other causes of GW. Finally, I have no credentials at all on the matter, but I hardly think it takes a scientist to use common sense when it comes to the GW issue. If it even exists to the extent we're told, I believe it is a naturally occurring, cyclical phenomenon. Again, that is only my opinion since I have no authority whatsoever on the topic.

Of course the sun warms up the world - you just dont understand the philosophy and science behind it I guess. We need the sun and we need a certain amount of CO2 to trap in the sun's warmth. The problem is when the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere now is significantly higher than it has ever been (going back at least 600,000 years) there is significant evidence thats is due to humans releasing CO2 gases. Take a look at the graph below......it measures global temperatures and CO2 levels over the past 600,000 years. You can see where the natural cycles of increased CO2 and temperatures coincide. The dips are the ice ages. The CO2 levels in the past 50 years or so have shot up to almost double what has ever been seen. You can think its all BS if you so choose, but to say that humans cant affect the environment is foolish....we already have in so many ways.

http://www.seed.slb.com/en/scictr/watch/climate_change/greenhouse.htm

[Zerstörer]

Of course the sun warms up the world - you just dont understand the philosophy and science behind it I guess. We need the sun and we need a certain amount of CO2 to trap in the sun's warmth. The problem is when the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere now is significantly higher than it has ever been (going back at least 600,000 years) there is significant evidence thats is due to humans releasing CO2 gases. Take a look at the graph below......it measures global temperatures and CO2 levels over the past 600,000 years. You can see where the natural cycles of increased CO2 and temperatures coincide. The dips are the ice ages. The CO2 levels in the past 50 years or so have shot up to almost double what has ever been seen. You can think its all BS if you so choose, but to say that humans cant affect the environment is foolish....we already have in so many ways.

http://www.seed.slb.com/en/scictr/watch/climate_change/greenhouse.htm

To quote Tim Patterson, paleoclimatologist and Professor of Geology at Carleton University in Canada: "There is no meaningful correlation between CO2 levels and Earth's temperature over this [geologic] time frame. In fact, when CO2 levels were over ten times higher than they are now, about 450 million years ago, the planet was in the depths of the absolute coldest period in the last half billion years. On the basis of this evidence, how could anyone still believe that the recent relatively small increase in CO2 levels would be the major cause of the past century's modest warming?"

In addition, Jan Veizer, environmental geochemist, Professor Emeritus from University of Ottawa, states that "at this stage, two scenarios of potential human impact on climate appear feasible: (1) the standard IPCC model ..., and (2) the alternative model that argues for celestial phenomena as the principal climate driver. ... Models and empirical observations are both indispensable tools of science, yet when discrepancies arise, observations should carry greater weight than theory. If so, the multitude of empirical observations favours celestial phenomena as the most important driver of terrestrial climate on most time scales, but time will be the final judge."

[Dr. Madd]

Global warming is a farce.. I need no long paragraph to chop it down. Every Volcano that erupts produce more "Greenhouse" gases than man has since he first learned to make fire. By that estimate, we should be Venus by now.

[dixiegirl]

LTS- the world may not revolve around us, but is sure has a gravitational pull in our general direction. example everyone hates us for glabal warming- kyoto treaty, plain and simple

[The anti liberal]

Global warming is caused by all of the hot air spewing continuously out of liberal mouths.

[Dr. Madd]

While we know that man can have an effect on the environment, I refuse the misbegotten notion that man can literally change the planet's climate.

[rightwingxtremist]

Indeed. Politically-driven global warming is just another new "untouchable" used to beat the shit out of the Americans.

I do not doubt however that we could take better care of the planet. Honestly speaking, I would like to buy a "plug-in" electric when they become available because doing so would suit my commuter driving style, wallet, and the air. I think that there are several areas where we are a bit excessive too, such as in generating lots of garbage. Smog is also very gross to look at.

However, if global warming is going to be used to terrorize the opposition, demonize people, and be primarly touted by scraggly, pony-tail wearing, unhygienic, coarse, verbally abusive liberals wearing microwave tofu burrito-stained greenpeace tee shirts - I'd rather toast the planet first.

-Nate

[alwaysRight]

Well I don't know what causes it but I sure wish I had some global warming in my area. It's been cold here.

Cow's let off more gas every day from their anuses than cars do. Volcanic eruptions produce more dangers to the earth than cars and aerosol sprays.

Global warming and cooling is natural.... not man-made.

[i_love_being_so_wicked]

I don't believe that global warming is that serious of a threat. It is so cold right here now in Illinois that I need to have my space heater by me when I use the computer or my fingers start to stiffen up from the cold. Plus my dad is too cheap to turn the heat way up even though he does heating and air-conditioning for a living along with general contracting. My dad says that the waste from using air-conditioning does not even compare in eating away at the ozone like the waste emitted from volcanoes does. I don't know. There may be pollution from cars and huge factories that eats away at the ozone but it is not only the United States that causes this pollution. I'm just tired of people complaining about saving the ozone and the earth anyway because civilization as we know it is going to end in 10 million years when the sun starts expanding out and burning everything in it's path all the way to Mars as it becomes a Red Giant and then it will collapse and burn out and become a White Dwarf. You can tell me I'm wrong if you want, but I learned this in astronomy class and it seemed pretty factual to me. So the earth is going to be destroyed anyway by the sun or it could happen before that if someone starts a huge nuclear war and everyone gets the crap bombed out of them. Either way, just remember to put on your sunscreen before you go out for a day of fun in the sun!